Breaking: Trump undermines his own attorneys in court - Brian Tyler Cohen

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Legal Breakdown episode 509: ‪@GlennKirschner2‬ discusses Trump undermining his OWN attorneys in court.

Transcript:

BTC: you're watching the legal breakdown
Glenn all eyes remain on this case
regarding Kilmar Abrego Garcia the
wrongly deported migrant to El Salvador
Trump had initially said that he would
respect the Supreme Court's ruling if
the Supreme Court ruled that he had to
be returned to the US The Supreme Court
did indeed rule exactly that that that
the Trump administration had to
facilitate his return And that note was
put on full display in the court case
Basically the the the plaintiff said
that Trump's own words were that he
would respect the wishes of the Supreme
Court in facilitating his return Uh then
Trump took to Truth Social and undermined
his own point I'll put the the post
right up here on the screen President
Bukele has graciously accepted into his
nation's custody some of the most
violent alien enemies in the world and
in particular the United States. These
barbarians are now in the sole custody
of El Salvador a proud and sovereign
nation and their future is up to
President Bukele and his government. So now it
sounds like Trump is going against what
he had initially said which is that he
would respect the Supreme Court's wishes
to bring him back to the United States
Now he's just basically wiping his hands
of it and saying "Uh you know he's uh
he's he's out of our hands at this
point." So what do you make of this?

GK: What I make of this Brian is this is Donald
Trump in substance giving the Supreme
Court the middle finger You know let's
let's just follow the bouncing ball of
injustice here because it was just two
days ago that as you mentioned Donald
Trump said and I quote "If the Supreme
Court said bring somebody back I would
do that I respect the Supreme Court."
And Brian that was in response to a
reporter asking him whether he would
bring Arbrego Garcia back if the Supreme
Court ordered him to do so That
statement the very next day on Saturday
made an appearance in the court filing
by Garcia's lawyers And here is what
they said First they quoted Donald Trump
as I just read And then they went on to
say of course that is precisely what the
Supreme Court did when it ruled that the
court's injunction meaning what Judge
Shinez ordered the Trump administration
to do facilitate the return of Garcia
from that El Salvadoran prison it
properly requires the government to
facilitate Garcia's release from custody
in El Salvador and to ensure that his
case is handled as it would have been
had he not been improperly sent to El
Salvador So now Donald Trump I'll tell
you if he's king of anything Brian he's
king of the flip-flop Because after he
said I will return him I will respect
the Supreme Court Then he posts
something that says as you just read
basically Garcia and the others that I
wrongfully deported to El Salvador are
now in the sovereign control of El
Salvador the inference there being and
there's nothing we can do to bring him
back He didn't say that last part but
Brian that was the clear implication of
that post And as I say that is a direct
FU to the Supreme Court And now when all
of these parties make their way back
into court it's on And I think Judge
Shines will have some very choice words
for the DOJ lawyers representing the
Trump administration on this issue and
she will probably feel compelled to move
toward contempt of court if if Donald
Trump's DOJ lawyers maintain just as
Donald Trump posted huh nothing we can
do because now Garcia is in the custody
and control exclusively of El Salvador.

BTC: And so I guess I guess that that really
is the question here is whether these
DOJ lawyers are going to allow Donald
Trump to do his posturing in public but
still abide by what the Supreme Court
and what this lower court now have to to
do which is to facilitate his return or
if they're going to completely reverse
course and just say well you know some
uh some errant synapse fired in Donald
Trump's brain and words fell out of his
mouth and that becomes our new guiding
principle here Is that correct.

GK: Yeah, so it'll be interesting to see what
position these DOJ lawyers take because
you know with every flip-flop Donald
Trump is cutting the legs out from under
his own DOJ lawyers in court You know
kind of making a mockery of the rule of
law and the Department of Justice I'll
tell you I would not want to be in the
position that these DOJ lawyers are in
Remember the last one who spoke candidly
accurately and truthfully in an earlier
hearing in the Garcia case he was
removed from the case and I believe
removed from the department altogether
He was certainly put on administrative
leave for being candid and honest and
truthful and accurate in court as was
that lawyer's supervisors I mean this is
a really dirty game that Donald Trump
and his attorney general Pam Bondi are
playing So it's anybody's guess as to
what the DOJ attorneys go into court I
believe on Tuesday which is the next
scheduled hearing unless the federal
court judge brings them in early on
Monday what position they will take But
let me just say I think it is a
laughable and insulting position for
Donald Trump's Department of Justice to
maintain that we snatched up Garcia We
disappeared him unlawfully and
unconstitutionally and in direct
violation of an earlier court order
prohibiting the federal government from
deporting him to th this country
specifically El Salvador We then
directed that he be put by the El
Salvadoran government in a prison in El
Salvador And Brian we are paying to have
him housed there Basically he is our
prisoner once removed We are footing the
bill And then in the next breath are DOJ
lawyers really going to say "But we have
no control over whether you know the El
Salvadoran government will allow us to
bring Garcia back." That's laughable
That's insulting and I I would bet my
full dollar that that will not fly in
federal court at any level trial court
appeals court or at the Supreme Court.

BTC: We, we've spoken about the prospect of a
constitutional crisis And I I I think
that I want to delineate between a
general constitutional crisis in that we
have a president who is so overtly
hostile to the Constitution as it stands
but then as it relates more narrowly to
the courts this would be a scenario
where it would take a ruling from the
Supreme Court where where they're the
final arbiter of this question and the
Trump administration defying that court
order for there to be at least on the
legal front a constitutional crisis
Would this finally be that moment and
what would the implications of that be?

GK: Yeah, so we use that term a lot
constitutional crisis And Donald Trump
has intimated if not come right out and
said um I respect the Supreme Court
ruling and would act accordingly But you
know what i don't really respect or feel
necessary to comply with trial court
rulings that tell me the chief executive
what to do or what not to do Here's the
thing He can certainly resist trial
court rulings but the only way he can do
it lawfully and constitutionally Brian
is if he files an appeal and if at some
level the uh some judge issues a stay of
the trial court ruling Otherwise it
really is a constitutional crisis even
if it is just defiance of a trial court
ruling not a superior court ruling or or
um opinion But but here's the other
thing because of the Supreme Court's
language in the Garcia case that opinion
they handed down which said "Listen we
are directing the Trump administration
to facilitate the release and be
prepared to share with the trial court
judge quote what you feel you can
share." Here's the thing the
mealymouthed imprecise nature of the
Supreme Court ruling in the in the
Garcia matter does for better or worse
give the Trump administration a little
bit of wiggle room So what I see now is
I see this thing making its way back up
to the Supreme Court fairly promptly and
given that Donald Trump just gave the
middle finger to the Supreme Court in
substance in that recent post that it
will be time for the Supreme Court to
put up or shut up And I hope what they
say is no no no In case there was a
misunderstanding when we told the Trump
administration to facilitate his release
and treat him the way he would have been
treated had you not unlawfully deported
him to El Salvador This is an order This
is an edict This is a directive that you
may not disobey That will be the moment
at which this matter will ripen into an
absolute textbook constitutional crisis
And at that point Brian all bets are off
because there is nobody to compel the
Trump administration to comply with a
Supreme Court order if he decides to
completely shit all over our
constitutional construct our separation
of powers which requires each branch of
government to respect the lawful
authority of another branch of
government And the Supreme Court wins
that battle But if Donald Trump defies
it you know we are then in completely
uncharted waters.

BTC: What do you make of the
fact that the the case Trump decided to
to test his hand at in basically defying
the courts is one where the justice has
ruled nine nothing against him It's not
like he would have you know look if he's
going to defy the courts which I think
we all kind of expected him to
do not not that not that it makes it any
better to do it on a 5-4 decision but it
would probably make a little bit more he
would probably have a little bit more
sympathy at least from the conservative
block of the court to do it uh if it was
54 or 63 But to do it on a decision that
they ruled against him 9 nothing doesn't
that seem like it would make it just a
little bit more difficult for him to be
able to carry out this uh this this act
of defiance?

GK: Yeah Brian it's a great
point. So let me sound like I'm talking
out of both sides of my mouth It makes
no sense and yet it makes perfect sense
It all depends on what the Trump
administration and what Donald Trump's
goal is if his goal is to not alienate
the Supreme Court when there is a case
where there is indisputable evidence
indeed a confession by the Trump
administration that we deported this
person unlawfully unconstitutionally and
in violation of a court order Why in the
world is that the hill you would choose
to die on because you are likely to
inspire the wrath of the Supreme Court
So it makes no sense but it makes
perfect sense if your goal as Donald
Trump is to reach as far and as wide as
you can to grab hold of all the power
for the chief executive for the
president of the United States that you
can including sending a signal to the
Supreme Court I don't give a rat's ass
about your supreme status over the
executive branch when it comes to these
constitutional questions I don't care
about the construct of our constitution
or the balance that is represented by
co-equal branches of government being
able to check one another I don't care
about any of it You just try to enforce
that court order to bring back Garcia
that you handed down And I don't believe
you can do it because you don't have an
army and I do That would make perfect
sense if that was Donald Trump's motive
behind his decision to die on this hill
the Garcia deportation and return hill.

BTC: Well look a this this is obviously
moving pretty quickly and we will have
some degree of at least resolution uh
answers here in the next couple days So
for those who are watching if you want
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I'm Brian Taylor Cohen and I'm Glenn
Kersner You're watching the Legal
Breakdown